Moby (00:00:08):

Hi, this is Moby and welcome to episode three of Moby Pod with me and Lindsay and Bagel. And today we are going to celebrate the release of the Punk Rock Vegan Movie and talk about punk rock and animal rights and veganism. And Lindsay, I believe we are even gonna have a guest, is that It's true. Okay. Yeah. Can you tell us about our guest?

Lindsay (00:00:35):

I would love to. Our guest today is Derrick Green, who we're both really excited to have, he features in Punk Rock Vegan Movie. He's a lead singer of the band Sepultura. He's also an amazing animal rights activist and the co-host of a show called Highway to Health and just a generally great human being. So why don't we go and do a little interview with Derrick.

Moby (00:01:09):

We just finished having lunch outside with our friend Derrick from Sepultura. And we're now gonna try and have a conversation outside with one qualifying caveat. We are outside in Los Angeles, which is the second largest city in the United States. Not surprisingly, it's noisy and we wanna talk about all sorts of things, especially like veganism, punk, rock, metal, touring, highway to health. But while we are doing our soundcheck, I as the engineer was inside listening to your guys' conversation. Okay. and you were talking about voiceover cause I'm so when the pandemic started, when you had your fancy gentleman's gray mustache.

Derrick (00:01:54):

Yes, I did. A mustache, the handlebar gray mustache. I got a lot of comments like a Danny Glover, Uncle Phil. There are all characters.

Lindsay (00:02:03):

<Laugh> That's really funny.

Derrick (00:02:04):

Favorite TV shows and movies.

Moby (00:02:06):

<Laugh> you as a, as a what? How tall are you? Like 6' 7"?

Derrick (00:02:09):

I'm 6'3". I'm 6'3"

Moby (00:02:10):

Okay. Well, you seem taller, especially

Derrick (00:02:13):

It's my shoes.

Moby (00:02:15):

<Laugh> like the contrast between you as someone to have a vegan lunch with, or when I interviewed you for the Punk Rock Vegan Movie, like you're so thoughtful and introspective and culturally aware. And then you see video of you on stage <laugh> and you are a gigantic monster person. Yes. It's one of my favorite aspects of the Punk Rock Vegan Movie is like everybody I interviewed was very thoughtful. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> and very quiet. And then like Rob Zombie or Ian Mackaye or HR or John Joseph. Then you or you mm-hmm. <Affirmative>, like, then you cut to these footage or images of these people on stage and they're the craziest performers who've ever existed. So I'm just pointing that out. That's not even really a question. I'm just self-involved person.

Lindsay (00:02:59):

I think it's beautiful. Every human contains multitudes.

Moby (00:03:02):

Yeah.

Derrick (00:03:02):

Absolutely. I think it's something that happens naturally with the combination of people that you're with. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> been in the process of writing these songs and then that energy from being in front of a live audience clicks together. And it's something very unique and special. And after seeing a show at the age of 14, seeing bad brains play, I knew this is exactly what I want to do with music. Wow. This style of music, seeing people react to the music in that way was something very new and I, I had never seen before where physically move people, you know? Yeah. To, to jump and to jump off the stage and be free. It reminded me a lot of the whole gospel scene mm-hmm. <Affirmative> of like, people praising, you know, like feeling this energy so much like, "Oh my God, oh lord Jesus, let me stand up and start dancing around.!"I was like, yeah, get this reminded like some old school, like gospel, but in hardcore way. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>.

Moby (00:03:54):

I would very much like to come back, but I still want, okay. I wanna do voiceover stuff for a second. All right. Okay. <laugh>. So do you have, cuz I was very impressed when I saw the social media posts that you were doing your sort of voiceover work

Derrick (00:04:08):

<laugh>. Oh Yeah.

Moby (00:04:10):

So do you have any voices that you feel like you can really inhabit that you feel comfortable sharing with us and are listening public?

Derrick (00:04:17):

Well, I do have a voice that's very low and deep like this. It's like a gravelly voice. It's so good. And it's very like a Barry White mm-hmm. <Affirmative> show. You write type of voice and can you, horse and wells. There's

Lindsay (00:04:28):

A, a real market for that one.

Moby (00:04:30):

So let's think. Yeah. <Laugh>, because that's also a good like, sort of intro to an action movie disaster. Mm-Hmm. Like, yeah. It's the same. Like, maybe say something. What if the current world is the disaster and you're like in a world where people eat innocent animals, raised in sad cages,

Derrick (00:04:47):

<Laugh>, "In a world where innocent animals are eaten by people, these animals need to escape or their fate is sealed." <Laugh>.

Lindsay (00:04:57):

Okay. I would watch it. I would go ticket bot <laugh>

Derrick (00:05:00):

In world gone mad

Moby (00:05:01):

<Laugh> <laugh>. Okay. I just wanted to hear like, yeah, like,

Derrick (00:05:05):

I think I can do, I can also do kind of like a New York accent. Yeah. That's, but that's like over the top, you know, at times, and I know with Tanya, I've done an Irish accent and, and, and that's difficult. It's scary cause it goes back and forth from like Jamaican to Irish and then like a pirate. So p <laugh>, it's like sometimes every, they're talking that way. And then I don't understand what you're saying at times. I don't know if it's a good one. Hardest one is definitely Scottish. Cuz then I, that's

Moby (00:05:31):

But, that's the only thing I can do. Really. Let me think. Now I'm ashamed. "So the, the thing is so me, gran is Scottish and so I grew up hearing a lot of Scottish and me Grandma was just a wee little person."

Derrick (00:05:45):

Impressive.

Moby (00:05:46):

It's really good accent. It's in my genes, Lindsay, My genes.

Lindsay (00:05:50):

Yeah. Oh my God. The Outlander fan girls are gonna go bonkers

Moby (00:05:53):

I don't do a Scottish accent cuz I'm ashamed to do do anything basically in public <laugh>. But it's the only accent I think I can actually get away with.

Lindsay (00:06:02):

Impressive. That's really good. Like that's really,

Moby (00:06:05):

I'm gonna hide basement for the next year.

Lindsay (00:06:06):

No, this is like my favorite thing that's happened in the last like nine days. Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative>. Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative>. That was good.

Moby (00:06:10):

Okay. So going back to what you were talking about was, so your first exposure to punk rock, was it that Bad Brain show?

Derrick (00:06:17):

It was either that Bad Brain Show or a Cro-Mags show actually. I was definitely 14 years old, but I think they were playing back to back the same week. It was the "I Against I" tour and there was "The Age of Quarrel" tour. "The Age of Quarrel" being the Chro-Mags album. And "I Against I" the Bad Brains.

Lindsay (00:06:33):

Were you living in New York at the Time?

Derrick (00:06:35):

I was living in Cleveland, Ohio.

Lindsay (00:06:37):

You were in Cleveland, you grew up.

Derrick (00:06:38):

I I grew up in actually a place called Shaker Heights. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, my mother wanted to move there from Cleveland. My mother was a music teacher and she felt that things were changing and she knew that moving to Shaker, you'd be able to go to the public schools there. And the public schools were one of the best in the country. I mean, I was seven or eight when we moved there. I had, I'd never seen a white person before or had friends. And my whole neighborhood was black where I lived in Cleveland. And then moving, there was a whole different experience, a whole different world. But we had the opportunity to choose whether to go to public school or to go to private school. And so <laugh> my brother and sister ended up going to private school and I went to Shaker Heights. And I didn't realize that this place was very unique. I mean, I thought every school had a planetarium. We had a planetarium, <laugh>, let alone, you know, an Olympic size swimming pool. You're

Moby (00:07:27):

Like, every school has massage therapists,

Derrick (00:07:29):

<Laugh>, every school has these things. Yeah. And of course, traveling outside of my school area, I realized I was sorely mistaken where people had no idea what a planetarium was, let alone be able to pronounce it. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. It was unbelievable experience. You know, my teacher, for example, British Lit, she was from England, you know Mrs. Hayley mm-hmm. <Affirmative>. And she was teaching British Lit there. Then we had a teacher from Cuba teaching Spanish. I mean, it was an amazing school.

Lindsay (00:07:57):

It sounds amazing.

Derrick (00:07:58):

Paul Newman was an alumni at my school.

Lindsay (00:08:00):

Wow.

Derrick (00:08:00):

And some other people in the comedy world.

Moby (00:08:04):

A completely random sort of self-involved question. How far away is Cleveland from Akron?

Derrick (00:08:09):

30 minutes.

Moby (00:08:10):

Okay.

Derrick (00:08:10):

35 Minutes.

Moby (00:08:11):

Yeah. Because my introduction to the world of punk rock veganism Right. Happened in Akron

Derrick (00:08:16):

Of all places. Wow. Home of LeBron James, <laugh>

Moby (00:08:20):

<Laugh> and, and Devo

Derrick (00:08:21):

And Devo. Wow. And The Pretenders.

Moby (00:08:23):

So more or less, okay, so a quick aside about like, because I just think it's interesting that, so I was introduced to punk rock veganism 30 minutes away from where you were, even though I was from Connecticut. Wow. So in 1982, my hardcore band the Vatican Commandos went on tour with three other Connecticut bands. CIA, Reflex From Pain, and 76% Uncertain

Derrick (00:08:43):

I love. 76% Uncertain.

Moby (00:08:45):

Oh, you know them?

Derrick (00:08:45):

Yeah.

Moby (00:08:46):

Oh, okay. <Laugh>. And our tour consisted of getting in a van, driving to Akron, playing a show in a pizza parlor for five people, and then driving back to Connecticut <laugh>. So when we arrived in Akron, we were staying in a vegan squat. Wow. And I remember waking up that Saturday morning on the floor after going to sleep at five in the morning. And there was some blue-haired punk rocker saying, Hey, welcome to such and such vegan squat. I made lentils and I was a 15 year old kid from the suburbs. And I was like, I didn't know what a lentil was. Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative>, I'd never, I'd heard of vegetarianism, I didn't know what vegan was. Right. But that was my introduction to veganism. The irony there is my friend Jeff and I rejected the lentils and we walked around the corner and went to a McDonald's and I got food poisoning and was having all sorts of terrible things happening on the ride back to Connecticut from Akron. Thanks. Thanks

Derrick (00:09:38):

Mcdonald's.

Lindsay (00:09:38):

Karma.

Moby (00:09:39):

So our exposure to punk rock and veganism happened right around the corner from each other.

Derrick (00:09:45):

That's Hilarious. That's, it's a small world. And my, I ended up going to Connecticut and because my sister ended up going to university there, Wesley University. Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative>. And so I remember going to Littletown, Connecticut. Yeah. So that was my Connecticut experience around that time.

Derrick (00:10:00):

<Laugh>

Lindsay (00:10:00):

A lady you said, you said your mom is a, was a music teacher. Correct. I mean, you must have had a very musical house.

Derrick (00:10:07):

Yeah. I mean,

Lindsay (00:10:07):

Was she teaching you from when you were little?

Derrick (00:10:09):

She tried, you know, especially piano and, and we had a piano in the house. But I didn't realize how fortunate we were to have that opportunity. Music teacher piano in the house. Yeah. Ready to go. She could play gospel. Wow. Cause she played a church and she played classical. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. So those are the two things I, we kept hearing back and forth all the time. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, classical, gospel. Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative>, classical gospel.

Moby (00:10:32):

And then of course the follow on question to that is, if your mom comes from the world of gospel and classical, has she, is she still alive?

Derrick (00:10:41):

No.

Moby (00:10:41):

Okay.

Derrick (00:10:41):

But she was straight edge

Moby (00:10:43):

<Laugh>. Really,

Derrick (00:10:43):

Really

Moby (00:10:44):

Like, actually, like X on the back of the hand, straight edge?

Derrick (00:10:46):

She could be mm-hmm. <Affirmative>. Yeah. Like no swearing, <laugh>, no liquor, no smoking.

Moby (00:10:51):

Did she ever have the opportunity to see you perform in your punk rock and or metal self?

Derrick (00:10:58):

Yes. <laugh>. And at first she didn't really understand. I mean, we were practicing with my hardcore band in their basement, my parents' basement. So they were okay with that. Just some of the neighbors like, just let us know like, these are the hours that are good. But everyone was really supportive, which helped tremendously. She didn't really fully understand until going to the show where they were. Both my mother and father were standing in front of the stage before we were getting ready to play your simple tour <laugh>. And so they're standing there and then some of the people in the audience like, oh, you guys here for the show? And they're like, <laugh>. And they're like, yeah, our son is playing. And they're like, you probably want to step back a little bit. It's gonna be a little crazy. And they're just like, oh, okay. And, but afterwards my mother was really proud of me. I mean, I remember I was traveling and she wrote me a letter explaining how she could definitely understand now seeing the reaction to people and how they loved it and mm-hmm. <Affirmative> and what we were doing. So that was really good to hear.

Lindsay (00:11:56):

That's So beautiful.

Moby (00:11:57):

Yeah. You got, that's the similarities cuz my hardcore band we used to rehearse in my mom's basement. Right. Same thing One time one of the neighbors came over with a gun <laugh> because he was drunk and we were making too much noise. Too late at night. Bill Seaberg, poor Bill, it's

Derrick (00:12:13):

A little excessive

Moby (00:12:14):

<Laugh>. Like, it's like Bill, just ask us to turn it down. Like you don't need to wave a gun around to shoot somebody. What my mom would do, cuz we would practice so loud, right? Is we had a tiny little like eight inch black and white TV and she had a little earpiece and she would plug it into the TV so she could watch TV upstairs while we rehearsed cuz it was too loud otherwise. Oh man. But it is kind of amazing. I don't know, just that that it, it made me realize how unique and special it is to have parents who wanted us to rehearse in the basement. Right. Who wanted us to play music, who were, who were excited. Like, I don't know about you, but I almost feel a little bit of guilt. Cause I know so many people grow up in households. Were like, their parents are very unsupportive of anything they try to do musically,

Derrick (00:12:55):

Artistically, unfortunately. Yeah. I mean it, I remember even an album DRI mm-hmm. <Affirmative> on one of their tracks and it sounded like one of their fathers like, you guys are making too much noise. Like turn it down. Yeah. And you know, most parents were like that. But actually the people I played with, their parents were very supportive even though they didn't understand the music what was going on. But just that we were there, you know, in the house safe, you know, not out doing like crazy stuff. And

Moby (00:13:21):

So, yeah. And I have a feeling, I don't know if your parents had the same thoughts. I assume so. Cuz like I think that my mom and my friend's parents were like, oh, these are good kids. Yeah. Cause we, we were like, we didn't drink, we didn't do drugs. We didn't ha really have friends. <Laugh> we didn't, were like, it's like, oh, like these are nerdy good kids. Like

Derrick (00:13:39):

Absolutely. We were definitely nerds and we were all the above, no drinking NoMo, like nothing, you know? Yeah. Really just skateboarding and playing music and going to shows.

Moby (00:13:50):

And so we fast forward or So it's, you're 14 <affirmative> and you see either the Chrome mags or the Bad Brains. Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative> and it's your Saul on the Road to Damascus moment. Oh yeah,

Derrick (00:14:01):

Absolutely.

Derrick (00:14:02):

Books at the show. Yeah. The Cro-Macs show. I remember they had the, the gida, there were books about vegetarianism and that's when it kind of like sparked like, these guys look insane on stage. Like really good shape. Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative> and just a lot of energy. And at the same time I was meeting friends from New York who were working in health food stores that were vegan or vegetarians. A lot of the guys from Yuta today. Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative> or Gorilla Biscuits. And they were working in this store called Prana . I don't know if you remember that place.

Moby (00:14:31):

Yeah. Prana is, I actually just didn't interview with a Canadian radio station yesterday. And I was like, Prana was ground zero for punk rock, veganism, prana. It was on first Avenue between seventh and eighth in New York. And it was an old, I mean like when you think of a sad, old, dusty hippie health food store, it's this place like the anemic cat, asleep of

Derrick (00:14:53):

Smell it, you know, it's like the smell is coming back to me.

Moby (00:14:56):

I shopped there constantly and everybody, I feel like Ray might have worked at Integral Yoga, but everybody else from like Walter

Derrick (00:15:06):

Arthur,

Moby (00:15:07):

I feel like Porcell either worked there, shopped there. Yeah. Every, so it was like this in Angelica's Kitchen, but Angelica's Kitchen we couldn't afford to go to. So in the late eighties.

Lindsay (00:15:16):

So everyone shopped at Prana,

Moby (00:15:18):

Everyone went at which

Lindsay (00:15:19):

Means life giving force.

Moby (00:15:20):

Yes, it does.

Lindsay (00:15:21):

For breathing.

Moby (00:15:21):

Yep. Did you just look that up?

Lindsay (00:15:22):

I did on the internet. <Laugh>. I Googled it just now. But

Moby (00:15:25):

Yeah, that, it's funny how when we were doing the, all the interviews for Punk Rock Vegan Movie, the recurring thing was Prana. Yeah. For first. I mean obviously not for some of the younger people in the movie cuz it closed in like 92. No maybe 94, 95. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. But like everybody from Rob Zombie, everybody Oh wow. Went through Prana . At some point. Like either a customer or you worked there. And I hadn't even thought about it in years. Cuz when you're growing up, it's funny cuz growing up being a vegan meant going to these weird old dusty hippie health food stores. <Laugh> and eating in weird old dusty hippie vegan restaurants Yeah. Or vegetarian restaurants. So you're just like, that's, that's veganism. And now to state the obvious, it's so shiny. Yeah. Like you go to like shiny health food stores and go to shiny vegan restaurants and it's great. But it's like, it's just so different from what it was. Oh yeah. When

Derrick (00:16:18):

We were, I mean,

Moby (00:16:18):

When we were young

Derrick (00:16:19):

People Exactly. Different. I mean there was no deodorant or anything. You just walked in. There was all sorts of smells hitting you. You know, whether it be spices or bo

Moby (00:16:28):

There's a that's sweet unique smell of vegan 1980s BO It's like, well I live in a squat. I bathe every two weeks. <Laugh>, I smell kind of like brewers yeast and fear

Lindsay (00:16:38):

<Laugh> <laugh>.

Derrick (00:16:40):

Yeah.

Lindsay (00:16:41):

So you see the Bad Brains or Cro-Mags. Right. And you see the vegetarianism. Right.

Derrick (00:16:46):

But that was my first like, experience, like thinking about it. Cuz I had an uncle that would come to the house and he was my mother's brother, and he would always come with his own food. And he was the first vegan that I knew. Like he, I was just like one of these grains and stuff. And I was like, Hm, these smell really good. You know, like different from what I was used to. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. But I was always curious about it. But I never really got into it with him. But he was a vegan for his, I mean, a large part of his life, you know, all way mm-hmm. <Affirmative>. So that was the first experience seeing that and then also hearing about it with like Dick Gregory.

Moby (00:17:23):

Yeah. Dick Gregory was a legendary comedian and a phenomenally outspoken el rights actor. Vegan. He was one of my favorite vegan quotes. I'm, I'm paraphrasing and I hope I don't offend anyone who's listening, but his quote is basically, it's really hard for me to hear you talk about justice when you have a stomach full of dead animals.

Derrick (00:17:44):

Wow. Wow.

Moby (00:17:45):

<Laugh>, he was like pulled no punches. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. That's bagel likes that too. Yeah.

Derrick (00:17:50):

Come on Bagel. Take it down a notch. So <laugh>. But yeah, so anyway, going forward. Yeah. I was like, wow, what are these books involving spirituality? Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> mm-hmm. <Affirmative> and veganism and the understanding of like animals and that they have a life force as well. Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative>. And I was like, I never thought about this. You know, and it was an avid reader as well. Like, I love books and I, I I just dove right into it and I was like, wow, I really want to try this and see if it's for real. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, this whole veganism type thing.

Moby (00:18:19):

It's so open-minded. Like it, and I, it makes, I'm kind of ashamed to say like, when I first heard about vegetarianism and veganism, I was sort of dismissive of it. Oh

Derrick (00:18:29):

No, no. I was like, this is, this is. I want to try it to prove it

Moby (00:18:33):

Wrong because I loved when I was a teenager. I loved McDonald's. Oh yeah. I loved pepperoni pizza. I loved steaks. So like, my, my conversion of veganism was like, I really didn't want to give up going to McDonald's and Burger Kings. I'm, I'm kind of amazed that you were that sort of like, rational and open-minded.

Derrick (00:18:52):

I was. I mean, I just wanted to prove it wrong though. I was just like, I don't think it's gonna make any difference.

Lindsay (00:18:57):

You're like, this isn't gonna work. Yeah.

Derrick (00:18:58):

I was like, let me try it though so I can at least mm-hmm. <Affirmative> confirm it a hundred percent. And then I started that journey and it was, I was pretty sick the first few weeks really craving it, you know, like, just like, oh my God.

Moby (00:19:10):

And how old were you at this point?

Derrick (00:19:12):

15.

Moby (00:19:12):

Oh, wow.

Lindsay (00:19:13):

Wow.

Moby (00:19:14):

That's amazing. Again, I'm kind of ashamed. Like at 15 I had, I, I was dismissing and ridiculing vegetarianism, but I wasn't gonna experiment with it. I was like, I'm gonna experiment eating more Burger King. I'm gonna experiment eating more bacon and sausage. Well,

Lindsay (00:19:30):

Also that's an age where like, fitting in was a big deal. And to, to do something that is so different from the norm from your whatever group that you're in. True. I think it's scary to a lot of people. Even, even now, it's hard to say, I wanna do something different than what everyone does.

Derrick (00:19:45):

Absolutely. I mean, but when you feel different already than it just seems normal in a way. Yeah. Because I mean, it was pretty different. My parents, like I said, didn't drink or smoke. They were avid Christians going to church every Sunday. Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative> and my mother teaching Sunday school singing in the church. Playing in the church. Not really pushing it so much on me, but I had to go to church every Sunday. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> up until a certain age where like, you can go or not. And I was like, I'm not going anymore. I'm free, I'm free <laugh> <laugh>. But the only thing I really loved about church was the part where we had a full band playing.

Lindsay (00:20:20):

Yeah.

Derrick (00:20:20):

And I was like, oh, here we go. Like mm-hmm. <Affirmative>. I was like, man, this bass player's so amazing.

Lindsay (00:20:24):

Yeah.

Moby (00:20:24):

With the drummer, I mean the rhythm section, gospel drummers are just.

Moby (00:20:28):

Yeah.

Derrick (00:20:28):

The best. They're the best. Just because they're playing with so much feeling and the spirit of the Holy Ghost in them, it feels, and whatever works for them, it was working. But I definitely felt on the outside because a lot of my friend's parents, they would come home and their parents would be hammered, you know, or, or they would be, be getting hammered on the way, like, ah, hard day at work, like whiskey or a cup of something. Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative>. And, and then they would just be talking about it like, oh, my parents were wasted last night or whatever. Or, and I would just see them and, and just, you know, that wasn't my world. It was Yeah. Radically different.

Lindsay (00:21:04):

So you were already feeling like, I can make whatever choices I want because I'm seeing my parents defy the societal norms.

Derrick (00:21:11):

Absolutely. And being that my parents were totally different as well. Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative>, I mean, my father grew up in the south, grew up in Georgia. My mother grew up in the north and my father grew up in a time during segregation existed. Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative>. So it was like whitewater fountain, Blackwater fountain, you know, it was so different from my mother who went to school, went to university mm-hmm. <Affirmative>, my father was like working in a field, you know, with nine brothers and sisters. Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative>, my mother had one brother, the vegan, you know mm-hmm. <Affirmative>. And she, and they both went to university, graduated and were able to maybe move on to stuff. But my father and mother met in church. That was their connection, you know, even though they were from completely different worlds, they had that in common and that's what like really drew them together. But my mother was always like, you gotta go to school, gotta have an education.

Derrick (00:21:59):

The same with my grandmother who grew up in the north and my father ended up being an electrician. I don't know he had a mind for that after like moving from the south and working his way up north. He was an incredible electrician, but that, hi. His brain just was geared to that, so mm-hmm. <Affirmative>. Yeah. It was, they're very unique individuals. And seeing all the people around me, I was like, wow, they're very different. I, my brother and sister different as well. And being able to have that freedom, you know? Yeah. But they were very set in their ways, but they weren't pushing, you know, like really gr you know, pushing us to be that. Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative>, they want us to be our own individuals to make our own decisions.

Lead Vocals (00:22:34):

That's amazing.

Lindsay (00:22:44):

We have talked a lot about like music in general, but I wanna talk specifically about Sepultura and like how you found your way to them and what the story is with that mm-hmm. <Affirmative> Band and how you work within the band and all of that. Mm-Hmm.

Moby (00:22:55):

<Affirmative>. Okay. I will add on to that. If you remember, like in the early to mid eighties, punk rock and metal were like basically like Judaism and Islam. Yeah. Like they were so far apart. And then, like you mentioned D R I.

Derrick (00:23:08):

Yes. The crossover, phase.

Moby (00:23:10):

and Metallica covered a killing joke song and a misfit song. So it started to be like a little bit in an anthrax. There were some like bands where it started to hybridize metal and hardcore. That's all I'm gonna say. Right. So, cuz cuz you are coming largely from the hardcore background. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> and Sepultura are known for being a metal band. Right. But I remember the first time I heard them I was like, wow, this is so fast. Yeah. Like, it's like clearly they've listened to some hardcore records. Absolutely. Okay.

Derrick (00:23:39):

Oh

Moby (00:23:40):

Yeah. Why do I talk so much, Lindsay? What's Mike? I'm just gonna shut up. Me and Bagel are just, just gonna go sit and listen.

Derrick (00:23:49):

<Laugh>. Well, the Cliff note version of it, I was living in New York working in bars and clubs in the East Village. And

Moby (00:23:56):

What

Derrick (00:23:56):

Year? 95, 96. Oh, what

Moby (00:24:01):

Were you bartending? Were you

Derrick (00:24:02):

I was the bouncer. Cool. Or the where the doorman, where'd you work? I worked at No Motel. Motel. Mm-hmm. <Affirmative>. I worked at Babyland, I worked at Beauty Bar. And then on daytime I had a job working at Fat Farm, working at Russell Simmons. Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative> Clothing store. That's

Moby (00:24:17):

Where I went. The one in Soho? In

Derrick (00:24:18):

Soho on Prince Street. And I also worked at Match on Mercer Street. Oh yeah. In the restaurant there. Yeah.

Moby (00:24:24):

Yeah. You remember? So one of my first ever DJ jobs in New York was at Lucky Strike.

Derrick (00:24:29):

Yes.

Moby (00:24:30):

On the corner from there.

Derrick (00:24:31):

It's the spot.

Moby (00:24:32):

They paid me literally in spaghetti. I didn't get paid money.

Derrick (00:24:35):

Yeah. They have great spaghetti.

Moby (00:24:36):

I got paid, like I didn't get money. I would DJ for like three or four hours and they would give me a free bowl of pasta. Oh,

Derrick (00:24:43):

Lucky.

Moby (00:24:43):

That's adorable.

Derrick (00:24:45):

Geez. That was the spot to

Moby (00:24:46):

Go to. And Beauty Bar, I used to live on 14th and third. So Beauty Bar was,

Derrick (00:24:50):

It was right around the corner. Yeah.

Moby (00:24:52):

Okay. So I'm just trying to provide a little bit of context. So it's 1995, you're in New York?

Derrick (00:24:58):

Yeah, I was in New York, but in 97. Yeah. That's when a friend of mine was an a and r person. He'd gone to a lot of different shows. His name's Mike Gitter and he ended up working at a label called Roadrunner Records. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. He had seen my previous band hardcore band from Cleveland. And he knew about me just from going to shows and I would see him there and he came to me and he was like, Hey, there's this band Sepu;tura, their singer has left and they're looking for a new singer.

Moby (00:25:31):

The old singer was Max, right?

Derrick (00:25:32):

Correct.

Moby (00:25:33):

And is, I don't know anything about him leaving. I don't know. Is that something we're allowed to mention? Is that a bad thing or No?

Derrick (00:25:39):

No, I mean, it's well known. I mean, it's, it's been talked about over and over. Okay. So I, so he decided to leave and so he, the band wanted to stay together and they had a tape going around tape, literally of one song that they had written. Not an old song, a new song with no vocals on it. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. And they were giving it to people all around the world. Like, you can do whatever you want with it. Your vocal, you can put over it your lyrics and make up something to this song. So I got a ver I got a tape of this and he was like, you should really try to do something. They need a singer that's radically different. So I got a tape and I heard the song and I decided I was gonna do this. I was like, wow.

Derrick (00:26:21):

I, I know the band. I'm not fanatical about them, but I know two of their albums and they're pretty heavy. Pretty intense. But they're different from typical metal band. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, they have different rhythms coming from Brazil and everything, their whole background. So I, I sent them a tape of me doing vocals and then I heard back from, and they're, and they're like, Hey, you should come to Brazil and do an audition and come down for two weeks. So they flew me down. I didn't know them. I didn't know how to speak Portuguese. I didn't know they spoke Portuguese in Brazil. I had to go to the library cuz there was no computers then. Really? And I had to use my library card and find books about Brazil. There weren't too many books about Brazil, just about South America.

Moby (00:27:04):

I mean, that's a very traditional heavy metal story. It's like going to the library with your library card to research the culture of the band you're auditioned for. I've never been there before. Isn't that where all heavy metal stories start <laugh>? Yeah. Using a library card. It's a library card

Derrick (00:27:19):

My library card. I mean, it was, it was no, you know, I'm just gonna Google it. I mean it didn't even exist. I was just

Moby (00:27:26):

Like, Google literally did not exist at that point.

Derrick (00:27:28):

Yeah, yeah. I was just like, what is going on? Why aren't there enough books about Brazil specifically? It was about South American General. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. Anyway, that's a whole nother story. Went there, met them for the first time. The first week was just kind of hanging out with them, getting to know them and their family cuz they were all very connected with their family and their friends. And so I'd go to like football games, go to the beach when I say football, and

Lindsay (00:27:51):

This was in the auditioning

Derrick (00:27:52):

Phase,

Moby (00:27:53):

So

Derrick (00:27:53):

They're partying. Wow, okay. It was just like a party. Yeah, yeah. Woo. This is great. Getting to know them and, and then the week after, like, okay, now we're gonna go to the studio and we're gonna jam. And I was like, all right. Very nervous just for the fact that I had a full week of seeing them in their element in Brazil where everybody knew them. You know, they were just like super celebrities. Yeah,

Moby (00:28:15):

It is, it is worth just Lindsay contextualizing a little bit. Sepultura are huge band everywhere, but in Brazil it's the, they're the biggest of the biggest band. Wow. Like, they, like

Derrick (00:28:26):

That's the biggest than any other artist.

Moby (00:28:27):

You would have a hard time finding a bigger artist in Brazil than Sepultura.

Lindsay (00:28:31):

Okay, Got it.

Derrick (00:28:31):

That's internationally known. And it was shocking to me because again, no internet, it was just from my own perception of, from friends telling me like, oh, check out this Sepultura. Yeah, yeah. Cape, you know, and I was like, eh.

Lindsay (00:28:43):

Yeah. It's hard to fathom it. Yeah.

Derrick (00:28:45):

I couldn't fathom it. It was no, there was no possible way like to understand until actually being there. And that's when there was like, ooh, getting a little bit nervous, you know, like, yeah, this is kind of weird, where like everybody's coming out to, to, to get autographs cuz they didn't have cell phones to take photos yet. So I went to the studio with them and they're like, okay, we're gonna play a song, not an old song. We're gonna play a song that we are writing and then you just, the next time we play it, you do some stuff over, Hey, and here we go. 1, 2, 3. And I was like, oh my God. Just like really felt bizarre. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, you know, and I, I, I don't know them either. And I've always played in bands with friends. Right. People I grew up with, people are as close to mm-hmm. <Affirmative>.

Derrick (00:29:24):

So it was really nerve-wracking and it was really horrible the first two days. I was like, oh God. And I remember I went to the beach with the bass player and I was like, ah, we're coming back. We're gonna go back to the studio, but you should really just let yourself go. You know, you're here, you know, this is an opportunity that's really big and, and, and don't hold back, you know? And then, and we got back and I was like, ah, you guys like other bands like I don't know, Bad Brains are like, yeah, let's, let's Jam This Bad Brain song. We're just like a cover of a song. And then we did that and I opened up a little

Moby (00:29:55):

Bit. Do you remember which song by any change?

Derrick (00:29:56):

I Do. It was Gene Machine. It was from the Quickness album. So I was like, oh, all right. I, I loosened up a little bit and then we started doing the songs again and then I started to flow with it. Like kind of go with what I was hearing and doing a little bit of melodical stuff. And this was something they were looking for. I didn't know they wanted somebody that they could do stuff in the future with not the same person. Try to do something where it's not only screaming, but have some melody that's in there or the option of doing something like that. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, you know, so they wanted somebody with diversity and I wasn't trying to sing like the old singer and that's what's what they were looking for. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. Yeah. A lot of the tapes they were getting, people were just trying to sound like the old singer

Moby (00:30:39):

I'm familiar with earlier Sepultura mm-hmm. <Affirmative>. And I remember the first time I heard them was on like a head banger's ball or some MTV show by the way. And it was the first time I heard in my, in my naive ignorance, the first time I had heard that type of singing mm-hmm. <Affirmative> because I had heard Panera, I had grown up with, you know, metal and screaming. It's the first time I heard the

Derrick (00:31:02):

Right, right, right.

Moby (00:31:04):

And I was like, what is that <laugh>? Like, what's he doing? So I imagine's the poor guys in Sepultura receiving all these demo tapes of just like everyone around the world going

Derrick (00:31:13):

Oh yeah, I, I'm sure.

Moby (00:31:15):

Which is a great, great way to sing. There are other ways to, to sing Metal.

Derrick (00:31:19):

Oh, absolutely. I mean it's grown tremendously. And I mean back then the label was definitely not Keene on having me for numerous reasons. I'm gonna go ahead and say it, but being black, not sounding like the old singer not being famous, you know, they were looking for something like a fill-in to jump right in and just continue doing what they had done in the past. Yeah. And that's exactly what the band is not about. Yeah. Each album was always different. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> each album had different producers. Everything was always different,

Moby (00:31:50):

Different percussion, different approaches. Absolutely different. Absolutely everything. I mean it's like really, I remember cuz I was loosely paying attention to the Sepultura story mm-hmm. <Affirmative> and I had assumed in my, again, ignorance that it was sort of similar to other metal bands who kind of start doing one thing and stick with it. Yeah. Like there's a tradition in metal of like, yes, you do one thing in 1979, fast forward 30 years, you're doing the exact same thing. Yeah. And Sepultura was like, oh, they kind of keep reinventing themselves. They keep Right.

Lindsay (00:32:21):

So brave, it's so brave to say, I know you loved that, but we're trying something different. Right. That's not but

Derrick (00:32:27):

In a natural way because they were just getting, they were, for example, they were leaving their country. But it's great that happened in a natural way, you know? Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative>, they were very young, they're stepping outside of Brazil for the first time. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> playing places they never imagined growing, learning a lot more. So that of course was gonna adapt into the writing of the music. There was gonna be an integral part of wanting to change because they had changed. Right. So it got to the point being away from Brazil for such a long time and missing elements of your home and the culture, that's when came about the album Roots, that was an album that was based on the roots of where they came from and using elements from Brazilian music that growing up were kind of like shunning, you know, like, ah, I don't want to have anything with that style of music or somebo that rhythm or anything that we want to stay away from that.

Derrick (00:33:18):

We want to just do our own metal style. And so when they started, they had a lot of similarities. The bands that they admire mm-hmm. <Affirmative>, you know, like Slayer and things like that. But then as time went on each album, they started to develop their own personality. They started to learn to write in English cuz they would always write in Portuguese and have their friend translated into English for them. But then that ended and they started writing their own. And you could feel the changes, but it was happening in a very natural way and not forced, which made a big difference.

Moby (00:33:48):

So, and so bringing it back again to the vegan aspect mm-hmm. <Affirmative>. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> is, so suddenly you are in one of the most successful metal bands in the world, the most successful band in Brazil. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. How did the people in the band respond? And especially how did their fans respond to like, here's the new singer, he's black. Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative>, he's American <laugh> and he's a vegan. Like, I wonder how the metal community in Brazil responded. Hmm.

Derrick (00:34:20):

Well, Brazil was always the integral part of the band as far as being the main support for all these years. There were always strong supporters of whatever the band was doing. Not everyone, but majority, you

Moby (00:34:34):

Know. So they accepted, I mean yeah.

Derrick (00:34:36):

Because I ended up living there and they were like, whoa, this guy is for real. He's really gonna live here in Brazil. He's, you know, we wanna see the band continue. Onward. They were, a lot of the people were always behind us in Brazil, especially outside of Brazil in places like America was, it was difficult because we didn't have the ability to play here as much as other bands because for us to play the US it involved getting a lot of visas. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, it cost a lot of money and, and we had a stronger market in Europe and the, the rest of the world.

Moby (00:35:08):

Yeah. I mean, that's all the times I've seen. Like, there are actually a couple times I've been on the same bill as Sep. Right. But the times I've seen you guys was always in Europe. Right.

Derrick (00:35:17):

Right. And that was the market that we were really going after. So a lot of the times the people who were, who weren't sure what was going on were in America. They were weren't really up to date at what we had been doing, but we had been really touring so much and doing all these shows and incredible places, places that a lot of bands and artists were never able to play. Like Cuba. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> India reunion Island, if you ever know where that is. Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative>, it's like

Moby (00:35:46):

Tiny. I've seen it on a map, but I don't remember where it is.

Moby (00:35:48):

Right. <Laugh> Close to Madagascar.

Derrick (00:35:51):

<Laugh>. And what about the sort of the vegan animal rights aspect? Aspect?

Derrick (00:35:54):

Okay. So that element surprising enough, people didn't really bother people that much at all. There's, I started to realize there are a lot of other people in the metal world that are plant-based.

Moby (00:36:05):

Is it the guy in Cannibal Court? No. No.

Derrick (00:36:08):

In Creator.

Moby (00:36:08):

Creator. That's right. Yeah.

Derrick (00:36:10):

Millie the singer.

Moby (00:36:11):

Because I, because I asked Alyssa mm-hmm. <Affirmative> from Arche, I was like, so who else in the metal world? And she's like, wow. It's a surprising number of people Yeah. Who are like, they look like the scariest people on the planet, but they're gentle animal rights activist vegans.

Derrick (00:36:27):

Totally. It was surprising. I mean, even younger bands like Aborted and some other bands that we toured with, they're like, oh, we're vegan. I was like, this is awesome. You know? Yeah. And, and it makes a big difference. You know, I, I could, it was finally like, all right, there's some other people, like, like-minded people and on the same boat and secret. Right. They have

Moby (00:36:48):

Literally on the same boat. Yeah. The metal cruise, <laugh> See Linz, see what I did right there?

Lindsay (00:36:53):

<Laugh>, that's that's a callback people. Yeah.

Derrick (00:36:56):

But yeah, it wasn't that much of a, a big deal. I think for them. They were just like, like you said, they were used to bands not stepping outside of their box. Like, why don't you play it like this album or this album. But that changed, you know, I've been in the band so long, there's been so many years that we've been playing. We have a whole new generation of kids that have never seen the band Yeah. Before I got in. So for them, they're like, oh, they're already in their thirties. And they're just like, yeah man, keep doing what you're doing. And it just, you know, it's been really incredible journey with them.

Moby (00:37:29):

I mean, it's just, I'm just surprised, very happily surprised that people accepted you as quickly and as well as they did mm-hmm. <Affirmative> because

Derrick (00:37:37):

I mean, it took some time. I mean, there were definitely like the cross armed, like shows that we're doing, just like waiting, like, okay, all right. I can, yeah. And then of course there's people like, I will never accept this. This is not acceptable. Yeah. The man has to be the original of this and this and, you know, that's fine. You know, that's, I never got into music to be like, to please everybody.

Lindsay (00:37:59):

Can't please everybody. Yeah. To go back. So you, so you go in for this audition process and then you're there for two weeks. How did they tell you that they wanted you to join? Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative>, their band. Like what was that? Did they tell you at the end of it? Like,

Moby (00:38:14):

Did, did they, did they bring you out and they give you a rose? Yeah. <Laugh>.

Derrick (00:38:18):

I wish. No, there was like a lot of fish, and <laugh>. No. It was just like, okay, well thanks.

Lindsay (00:38:24):

And then so you go back

Derrick (00:38:25):

Yeah. I go back to New York and I'm just like, oh man. I was like, I really miss Brazil. I really want to go back. No. Cause before I was like, I'm getting a free trip to Brazil. Yeah. <Laugh>, like, I was, was like, I might as well just go.

Moby (00:38:36):

And was this São Paolo or

Derrick (00:38:37):

Yeah, São Paolo. And I, I was just like, man, I really miss being there. Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative>, that whole vibe was great. It was really new and challenging. And, and then about a month later they called and they're like, Hey, you want to come back to Brazil and work on this album? Cuz they had a lot of the songs written. And I, I I just was like, oh my God. Like, I can't believe it. Like, yeah. <Laugh>, I definitely want to go. You're like, yeah, the first show is gonna be like a free show where you bring food and you get in, we're gonna invite a bunch of guests like Jason Newsted from Metallica, Mike Patton from Faith No More. We're gonna have like the Shonti Indians come from the Amazon and perform, it's gonna be like 30,000 people. So we'll see you in Brazil. And I was just like, what?

Lindsay (00:39:23):

You're like, no pressure.

Derrick (00:39:24):

Yeah. And then it was like, and then it really was like, oh my God, this is insane what's happening. But it just happened so fast. Yeah. You know, the recording process of going there, not only recording in Brazil, but in the LA and Sado Island with Kodō drummers. Like, we were just like really out there with like, the ideas of this album that we're gonna do, introducing this new singer, the new band, you know, like a whole new sound. And we just went off, we're like, let's do this. Like, just show everybody and and just go against what people might think.

Lindsay (00:39:57):

That's so cool. Here's another very important question to me personally, because I think about it all the time mm-hmm. <Affirmative> when I listen to metal. Okay. And even some punk, but mostly metal, which is how do you take care of your voice and not get nodes? And not just like, like how do you do that? I mean, is it just technique or is there other things that you're doing to take care of

Moby (00:40:17):

Yourself? I I assume it helps being a giant human being. Well, having a very deep natural, very small human being. <Laugh>. So like, like almost everybody's pretty big compared to me. But like, Derrick is a, a large, like, clearly like more physically evolved specimen. But yeah. It's a great question. I'm, I'm just rambling

Lindsay (00:40:37):

For people that, I mean that people that do not have your size mm-hmm. <Affirmative>. So there has to be, I mean obviously there's incredible technique involved, but I just wanna know more about that because I know musical theater people that, you know, have to belt eight shows a week and they all get these terrible nodes and then they have to take time off and go on vocal. Like it's a whole thing. So I'm just wondering what the, what that's like for you.

Derrick (00:40:57):

At the very beginning, the guys suggested that I see a vocal coach here in LA. But he was fantastic. He worked with James Hetfield from Metallica, Bjork, Janet Jackson. He worked with everyone. He would,

Moby (00:41:11):

James Hetfield, Bjork and Janet Jackson. Like, that seems like the beginning of very bad joke. Like, so James Hetfield, Bjork and Janet Jackson walk into a bar

Moby (00:41:20):

The peanut said I'm assaulted <laugh>.

Derrick (00:41:22):

But it, it definitely helped. It was, it it, you have to do these vocal exercises before and after the show dos and don'ts. He taught me, you know, about like, you shouldn't drink alcohol ever Yeah. Before a show. And if you can after definitely not, it'll shrink your vocal chords. No smoke whatsoever being around that. No loud talking or talking in general after show. As much as possible, keep it to a minimum. And just health-wise, you know, eat well, stay away from acidic type foods. Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative> tomato sauce and things like that. Don't use this honey or anything like that. Don't use any these sprays that numb your voice cuz you won't know mm-hmm. <Affirmative>, when you do have a problem, whoa. And you'll become addicted to it if you don't have it. So all these tips that I got and practice definitely help. And you know, fortunately I never had to cancel a show out of the 20, over 25 years of doing

Lindsay (00:42:16):

It. I'm sure you've seen that happen to other, like Absolutely.

Derrick (00:42:19):

Yeah. But I've seen them also not take care of their voices. And, and for me it's very serious. I always have this reoccurring dream where I'm screaming and nothing is coming out. It's so scary. It's like a terrifying feeling. And I never want that for a show, but I usually just try to take it easy on tour and not overdo anything. Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative> and just mm-hmm. <Affirmative> as far as after a show and before a show and just take that very seriously.

Lindsay (00:42:42):

Is there a technique to like how you make the sound that's safer than

Derrick (00:42:46):

Just like yelling, it's not using your throat? Yeah, it's really pushing that air and having a very strong diaphragm and pushing that air and using the roof of your mouth to blow and mm-hmm. <Affirmative> create the sounds by opening your mouth wider mm-hmm. <Affirmative> or, or closer creating like higher, lower tones. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. But just getting comfortable and relaxing your vocal chords and your throat and not using it so much is like you know, getting,

Lindsay (00:43:08):

You have to try like push it out.

Derrick (00:43:10):

You just, you really need to relax that. And being around good producers that can hear when you start doing that. Yeah. In the studio, they're like, don't do that. Like, loosen it up. Wow. Just belt it out. But just use that Force

Lindsay (00:43:21):

It has to come from the right spot.

Derrick (00:43:22):

Right

Moby (00:43:29):

And when did you finally sort of bite the bullet? Did you go to like, my route shared by almost everybody's like the vegetarian leading to vegan route? Yeah. How did that happen?

Derrick (00:43:39):

It happened because I think after a while people were just like, you just might as well go vegan. You know, it's like you're vegetarian for so long and just do it. It doesn't make any sense. And then I started to learn more about the whole dairy process and everything. It was just learning out the treatment of animals and to your body and to the planet. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, all these things start to come out, all this information.

Moby (00:44:00):

And when was this?

Derrick (00:44:03):

For me? I started really thinking about it like seven years ago mm-hmm. <Affirmative>. But I think that information was something that I just never had before. I wasn't really paying too much attention to that, but it, it started to come across, you know seeing a lot of the statistics and everything that was happening mm-hmm. <Affirmative> in that whole world. Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative>, I was like, oh my God, this is just as damaging, you know, as the meat industry. And then it was easy to really stop. I'm, it was much easier than I imagined actually.

Lindsay (00:44:29):

It's an, I mean, it's an easier step once you've already learned how to live in a world without meat. Right. You already know the places to get all mm-hmm. <Affirmative> things. Mm-Hmm.

Moby (00:44:38):

<Affirmative>.

Derrick (00:44:38):

Well, I also was radically opposed to giving money to these companies. Yeah. I was just like, I don't wanna support these companies. These companies could care less about me or the planet or the animals. And, and this was something that was disturbing to like support mm-hmm. <Affirmative> these companies is, I mean, people don't realize how much power they have in their money. Yep. And they're buying whatever they're consuming. You collectively get a group of people, you can really change things radically. So you have a lot of people that demand meatless products then that will come about. And I've seen it happen where we've done like metal cruise ship and we're going out and, and then I was like, oh boy, I'm gonna starve on this. I know it's only gonna be like meat and whatever. And, and they had a full vegan area, like set up just like everything else starting with appetizer, the meal, dessert, all vegan. Amazing. And I was shocked. I was like, how did this come about? They're like, ah, A lot of people were really complaining about it, <laugh>. Like, there's not big enough options. And, and so we decided to really step it up.

Moby (00:45:37):

I mean, first of all, it's kind of amazing. There is such a thing as a metal cruise. <laugh>,

Derrick (00:45:42):

<Laugh>, there's quite a few of them.

Moby (00:45:43):

Secondly, I really want to, the idea of going on a metal cruise seems

Lindsay (00:45:47):

There's, there's definitely an appeal.

Moby (00:45:49):

So as a Oh no. As a fan, who are some of the bands?

Derrick (00:45:52):

This is a good question.

Moby (00:45:52):

that you've seen on a metal crew. And then I wanted to say like how amazing it is that there's a metal cruise, but then there's vegan food, <laugh> on a metal cruise. Like, everything about that seems

Derrick (00:46:02):

Like a vegan buffet. Like,

Moby (00:46:04):

Like basically I'm hallucinating. Like I've taken too much mescaline. I'm in the desert. This is a hallucination

Derrick (00:46:10):

And a packed line. Mind you where I was almost getting vegan

Moby (00:46:13):

Buffet

Derrick (00:46:14):

The vegans are ready Get outta the lobby.

Moby (00:46:16):

The vegan buffet on the metal cruise. So who are some of the other bands? Okay. On a metal cruise?

Derrick (00:46:22):

Kiss, they have their own cruise bands like Cannibal Corpse. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> just spend Saboton I saw this band Voivod from Canada. Yeah. They were fantastic cuz I got to sit in the theater like in the back, just kind of sit and watch the host set from the beginning to the end. And I love that feeling of just being able to, to watch a show like that without being harassed by like, people, like, what's up? What's going on?

Lindsay (00:46:47):

Yeah. Yeah.

Moby (00:46:47):

I mean it, that happened a lot, especially in Brazil. It's impossible to see a show. But on the cruise, people are very respectable. The, the people who are attending the cruise, they understand that you're trapped on the boat, so they're not like harassing you. Yeah.

Moby (00:47:02):

They're, and also probably it's probably like it, cause I used to own a restaurant in New York and so it was like the height of my weird fame. And you could tell like the first day people would come in and be like, Hey, there's moi. Right. And by day six they're like, who cares? Right. Like there's the bald guy again. No big deal. So I imagine if you're on a cruise with someone Yeah. Like the first day they're probably like, that's Derrick from Sep Jira by day three. It's like, I wish he'd get out the line. Like, I want to get the fries. Same.

Derrick (00:47:28):

No, totally. It's like could you step aside please, <laugh>? No, it's exactly that way. And, and, and they have a lot of respect and people are waiting all year to do the cruise and they meet their friends and it becomes like a reunion for a lot of the people on the cruise. And everyone's in great spirits, especially people working there. They're like, oh, this is the best crowd that comes on the cruise. Whenever we have like electronic music, it's the worst. And I was like, whoa, why? And they're like, oh, because they're just doing a lot of drugs destroying the place. Just like staying up like all night. It's a mess. But the metal crews, a lot of people are very respectful to the people working there and those people working, there're love rock and metal mm-hmm. <Affirmative>. So they're just very excited to see some of the bands that they admire and enjoy.

Lindsay (00:48:13):

That's so funny. It's funny the difference between the two.

Moby (00:48:16):

Oh yeah. Okay. So I, we have some, I have some very basic vegan questions. All right. Okay. Because you are a road warrior touring musician. Correct. So the, the most basic question I have is where have you found to be the easiest to be a vegan. Where's the hardest and where is the most surprising? By way of example, the best vegan food I had on my last tour, Gadens Poland.

Derrick (00:48:44):

Wow. That's, I thought you say that.

Moby (00:48:46):

Completely surprised,

Derrick (00:48:47):

Beautiful place, right? I

Moby (00:48:49):

Was on the water, I was like, I was like good, dank, like amazing. Some of the best vegan food I've ever had. It's been some very surprising places. So again, I'm answering my own question. Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative>, because I'm a narcissist, so I'm gonna stop talking. And

Derrick (00:49:01):

<Laugh> <laugh>. It's funny that you say that cuz on this last tour, Poland was definitely one of the top three amazing plant-based meals that we had on tour at the venue. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> and this woman created all these dishes from lunch to dinner, all phenomenal, like mind blowing. Even the dressing room was set up with everything from candy to snacks, all plant-based. But one of the top, I think from this Pasteur was Berlin. They went over the top, the chef just did his homework. He knew that we were coming from South America, so he made sure to have a lot of different dishes from South America or that idea,

Moby (00:49:38):

Like one of my favorite ve that we tried to make it Little Pine, but it just didn't quite work, was Feijoada.

Derrick (00:49:45):

Ah, Feijoada.

Moby (00:49:46):

Two things about it. One, I had vegan Feijoada the last time I was in Brazil and it was so good. The other reason I bring it up, it's just such a fun word to say Yes,

Lindsay (00:49:58):

Feijoada. Ooh

Moby (00:49:59):

<Laugh>. Isn't it nice? Like, don't you wanna go to a restaurant and say like, oh, I'll have the Feijoada. Like, I don't even know what Feijoada means, except that it's like some black beans thing.

Derrick (00:50:07):

Black Beans. Yeah.

Moby (00:50:08):

It's Delicious.

Derrick (00:50:08):

That's a staple meal in Brazil. It's everywhere. Every Wednesday.

Moby (00:50:13):

Yeah. So don't you wanna try

Lindsay (00:50:15):

Feijoada? I really fish do. I'm dying to try. Yeah.

Derrick (00:50:17):

The first time I try, I really saw it. I was like, oh, Feijoada. And they're like, yes, there's no meat in there. And I was like, Hmm, that looks like a pig ear floating in there. And they're like, oh, that's for flavor <laugh>. I was just like, oh, all right.

Lindsay (00:50:29):

You're like, that's very clearly

Moby (00:50:30):

An ear, ma'am.

Derrick (00:50:31):

<Laugh>. He was like, no, we'll just scoop it out to the side. And I was like,

Moby (00:50:35):

Well, we can bring you a bowl with less ears.

Derrick (00:50:36):

Yeah. Less ears. Less,

Moby (00:50:39):

Less. Oops. Okay, so, so Berlin. And

Derrick (00:50:43):

I would say the most surprising was Russia. Just because I was lucky when I went there because it was lt. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> every place that we were staying at that time, all plant-based menus, incredible food. And it was like, man, they should do this more often. I mean, they had great ideas that they were doing. So that was definitely sticks out of one of the best places that I've had. Vegan food that surprisingly mm-hmm. <Affirmative> plant-based. I don't know. LA is pretty good. I mean, it's

Moby (00:51:14):

Definitely, I mean, I like to remind people cuz I've been doing a lot of interviews around the movie and there's that old question of like, so how are things different now than they were in 1987? Cause that's when I went vegan. Yeah. I'm like, well, to put it in perspective, there are more vegan restaurants in a two mile radius of where we are sitting right now. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> than there were in the entire world in 1987.

Derrick (00:51:35):

Wow. But I gotta say that Sao Paalo, I mean Brazil itself is a big meat eating country and mm-hmm. <Affirmative> and it's known for Churrascaria. It's like a barbecue place. Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative>. And it's changed.

Lindsay (00:51:48):

Oh, that, is that where they bring out meats on

Derrick (00:51:50):

Swords? Yeah. So spits, yes.

Lindsay (00:51:52):

And they, there's lots of swords and meat.

Derrick (00:51:54):

A lot of swords and meat.

Lindsay (00:51:55):

Yeah. Yeah. <Laugh>.

Derrick (00:51:55):

Yeah. And you got your sauces and things like that. Yeah. Yeah. it changed radically where the, it has one of my favorite restaurants two of my favorite places are there in Sao Paulo, where they just really stepped it up. It's impressive being with like-minded musicians who are plant-based. We developed an idea of coming up with the TV show called Highway to Health. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, myself and Tanya O'Callaghan, who's from Ireland. And she's a traveling musician activist, bass player extraordinaire. And we do a show together.

Moby (00:52:38):

All around delightful person.

Derrick (00:52:40):

All delightful. Very delightful. <Laugh>. I very delightful there. Oh, there's my Irish accent

Moby (00:52:44):

For her, isn't it? What, what's it called again?

Derrick (00:52:46):

Pirate. Pirate

Moby (00:52:48):

Pirate ish. <Laugh>

Lindsay (00:52:50):

Pirate ish.

Moby (00:52:52):

Cause it's like Pirate Jamaican Pirate

Derrick (00:52:54):

Pirate. Jamaican Pirate

Moby (00:52:54):

Lep

Derrick (00:52:56):

Leprechaun Pirate. Yeah. <laugh> Leprechaun Pirate. Jamaican Leprechaun Pirate

Moby (00:53:00):

I think we'd just come up with a great new Netflix cartoon idea. The Leprechaun Pirates

Lindsay (00:53:04):

I'd watch it.

Moby (00:53:06):

So Highway to Health.

Derrick (00:53:07):

Highway to Health as watching during the pandemic, or even before, actually way before I was watching a lot of these travel shows where they're going to exotic places mm-hmm. <Affirmative> and eating incredible food. Like crazy food. Like most people would never buy or afford. And I don't know why they would be eating in the first place, cuz it's some type of very unique animal. Yeah. and it was frustrating because I'd never seen a show where they were going to places having healthy food or something reasonable where an an an average person can go and eat and enjoy something. So the whole idea, we, we both had this concept of traveling to places unknown or known, that we've traveled to having conversations with food involved, plant-based food and that whole world, not only health-wise and plant-based world, but also mental health, physical health, and hitting all this topics and, and, and doing interviews with people who are from different walks of life and having people that aren't necessarily vegan on, but also have other people that are disciplined in, in the mind or mm-hmm. <Affirmative> in some other ways. You know. And, and again, this show is geared towards people who are not vegan. So they can kind of answer those questions they might have and to break all the stereotypes that exist around it.

Lindsay (00:54:25):

That's really Cool

Moby (00:54:25):

And it and Highway to Health is debuting in March?

Derrick (00:54:29):

In March. It'll be debuting in March on our YouTube channel.

Lindsay (00:54:33):

And I can go and subscribe on your YouTube channel now?

Derrick (00:54:35):

That's right. Go and subscribe <laugh> and it it's gonna be fantastic. We have yourself on there. Just

Lindsay (00:54:41):

Moby on it.

Moby (00:54:42):

Just, he was pointing at me.

Derrick (00:54:43):

Yes. Moby on it.

Moby (00:54:44):

I know that podcasts are not necessarily a visual, medium.

Derrick (00:54:49):

But Yeah, bagel is not on the

Lindsay (00:54:50):

Bagel. Bagel is not, unfortunately No, Bagel is not on it though. She really knows how to live, you know?

Derrick (00:54:54):

Yeah. But we have a lot of incredible guests. It's a lot of fun. We have a lot of laughs. We, we go all over the world, you know, we're on the Kiss cruise with Tanya and Steven Adler. So fun. Steven Adler's in another episode with Toby Morse.

Moby (00:55:08):

Yeah. I had a And then Stephen was one of the original Guns N Roses members. And brother, I remember one time when Crossroads first opened, there were all these rock legends, like Geezer was there from

Derrick (00:55:21):

Geezer core

Moby (00:55:22):

Credit to Geezer from Black Sabbath Geezer. I think he was vegan before anyone, maybe Apart from your uncle. I love that. And Dick Gregory. But like, Geezer's been vegan I think from the early seventies. That's so great. And you tell people like, wow. Yeah. The the songwriter from Black Sabbath has is the original vegan. I

Derrick (00:55:39):

Love that. OG Vegan.

Moby (00:55:40):

But yeah, I was at, at Crossroads and like Geezer was there, Dave Grohl was there, Paul McCartney was there. I mean granted Paul McCartney, I wouldn't call him in like a Well he wrote Helter Skelter and Steven Adler was there and like all these rock guys were at a vegan restaurant. And I was like, how did this happen? Like, this is so people start in terms of making it cool. That was pretty cool. That's pretty

Derrick (00:56:04):

Cool. Cool. Very, very cool. And that's another thing with the show, it definitely show very cool people, very interesting people who are cool, who are also plant-based. So love that. I think it helps a lot.

Moby (00:56:23):

So Derrick, thank you for giving up so much of your time and coming over.

Derrick (00:56:26):

It's a pleasure.

Moby (00:56:26):

And having lunch and meeting Lin. Well you met Lindsay before, but meeting Bagel I

Lindsay (00:56:31):

You met Bagel before too.

Derrick (00:56:32):

I met bagel before to some other dinners,

Moby (00:56:35):

There's that Caribbean, Irish pirate <laugh>.

Derrick (00:56:38):

He's back again. Yeah. Now this is more of a pirate one.

Moby (00:56:42):

<Laugh> <laugh>. And thank you for being such a smart, thoughtful, outspoken plant-based activist. Like to, to Lindsay's questions like how do we make veganism cooler? Like be more like Derrick. Yeah. Oh

Derrick (00:57:00):

Man. Thank you.

Lindsay (00:57:01):

Be more Derricky.

Derrick (00:57:02):

So much guys.

Moby (00:57:03):

Yeah. Minus, minus the Jamaican Irish

Derrick (00:57:07):

Yes. Minus that. Everything else. Yes.

Moby (00:57:10):

So thank you so much for

Derrick (00:57:11):

Absolutely.

Moby (00:57:12):

Coming over. And granted, now that I realize you live pretty close, I'm gonna have to have you come over. Well, we should meet up more often. I assumed you live far away so I Oh

Derrick (00:57:20):

No. I'm gonna e-bike right away. Yeah,

Lindsay (00:57:23):

Yeah. Derrick showed up on the coolest looking e-bike I've ever seen. And has been charging the battery for It.

Moby (00:57:29):

That's the coolest thing we literally see e I've ever seen. Yeah.

Lindsay (00:57:32):

Yeah. It's really cool. Anyway, thank you so much for doing this, Derrick. Thank you. You the best.

Lindsay (00:57:43):

Well that was freaking delightful. Derrick Green, thanks again. I just wanna take a minute and say thank you to you, the listener for listening. It's a really cool thing you're doing. Please don't forget to send us questions or comments or feedback or dog pictures to MobyPod@moby.com. We love the questions and the stuff that's coming in, so please keep it coming. We love to be responsive and chat with you back. So keep that in mind. And also while we're at it, if you want to go and share the podcast or even just rate it, review it on your favorite podcasting app, that would mean the whole dang world to me and Moby and also Bagel, but now Moby are, do are you, do you wanna talk about some, some

Moby (00:58:31):

Stuff? Well, yeah, I mean the theme of today's episode three Moby Pod is the Punk Rock Vegan Movie, and also punk rock and animal rights and vegan activism. Cuz the whole reason we made the movie was to both talk about the history of punk rock and animal rights, but also to try and use creativity to try and use our odd little production company, Little Walnut to look at animal rights and look at veganism in hopefully what's a, a kind of unique, if not idiosyncratic way.

Lindsay (00:59:11):

So Moby and I produced this film with you and there's a question that I've never asked because before we began, I came on to start working on this movie with you. You'd been recording the interviews for some time, but I've never really asked you like, what was the spark, the impetus for you to decide that this was the movie you wanted to make? Where did that come from and what was that very first like, step in conversation like? Okay,

Moby (00:59:40):

So I was at this event a fundraiser for Mercy for Animals and I was talking to a bunch of fellow animal rights activists and somehow the conversation turned to the history of animal rights. And I was talking about the early days of punk rock, animal rights activism, you know, with Crass and Youth of Today and Bad Brains and the people I was with who all had tattoos and were committed animal rights activists didn't know that a huge part of the animal rights movement evolved and originated in the punk rock scene. Because there's this assumption on the part of a lot of people that punk rock is nihilism that punk rock is just destruction for the sake of destruction. And I guess presumptuous, not even presumptuous, but just based on evidence and based on growing up in the punk rock world, I know that hardcore, especially American hardcore is so principled, you know, and I can see someone goes to a, a hardcore show and you see people stage diving, the singer is screaming at the top of their lungs and you can make the assumption that it's chaos, but it isn't.

Moby (01:00:52):

It's so principled cuz there is that core ethos. The central ideology of punk rock is questioning, you know, you look at everything in the world and you question it, you question the fashion, you question the music, but you also question food. And that's what led so many of the original punk rockers and even hardcore punk rockers today to become vegans and animal rights activists. So that, Lindsay that's my long-winded way of answering your question. It was basically being surprised that a lot of people were not aware of the history of punk rock and animal rights and wanting to shine a light on that and remind people of just how important that punk rock ethos of questioning and replacing the things in the world that don't conform to our values.

Lindsay (01:01:40):

Yeah. I mean, I have to say I was very unfamiliar with that world and to me looking in, I always saw it as something that was aggressive. I don't know if you remember this Moby, but we went to that Bad Brains show. Do you remember?

Moby (01:01:56):

Oh yeah. I, I played with Bad Brains

Lindsay (01:01:58):

At Shepard Fairey's studio. Yeah. And it was so cool. And you played with them and I remember before we went you were like learning the to play bass for the, for these songs

Moby (01:02:07):

Guitar. But yeah

Lindsay (01:02:08):

Oh, was it Guitar?

Moby (01:02:09):

Similar to bass? Just a couple more strings. Yeah.

Lindsay (01:02:11):

Oh, Well, you know, I'm not a musician <laugh>. You said it was really, really hard. You said it was one of the harder things you've had to learn. And I was really, really impressed by that because I think of you as kind of this musician that can do pretty much everything, but to see you be challenged by the music was so unbelievable to me. I was like, okay, wow, they're doing something really cool. But I didn't really know what to expect because I wasn't super familiar with the bad brains other than like, you know, from a very outsider perspective. But then we went and I don't know, remember if it was them playing or somebody opening for them, but the crowd was so aggressive and I'd seen a mosh pit before, but there was something really next level about this. There were people climbing the walls and then jumping down into the crowd. Do you remember

Moby (01:02:54):

That? Oh yeah. And I fully understand how anyone standing outside of that can just see violence and chaos. And I guess that is the sort of fascinating juxtaposition or paradox within the hardcore punk world is it's so aggressive and looks so loud and potentially violent, but it's so ethical. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. And of course there's lots of punk rock that's not principled. I mean, especially, you know, when punk rock became popular in the nineties, you know, with bands like Rancid and Green Day, and I really like Rancid and Green Day, but like as it became more popular, it became more like Woodstock 99. Like there was a lot of punk rock that was really just meathead frat boys who wanted to punch each other in the face mm-hmm. <Affirmative>. But separate from that, separate from the meathead idiots was this spirit of intelligence and questioning. And that's what I grew up with.

Moby (01:03:51):

And yeah, that was the goal of the movie is to really look at that and even more so to try and remind people that that ethos of questioning and the ethos of taking ownership of the institutions in our lives and not supporting institutions that don't conform to our values like it, it seems like a lot of us have forgotten that a lot of us have just gone along and are involved in a culture that we don't respect. And we're involved in a culture that doesn't reflect our values. And what was great about growing up in the world of punk rock is it basically said, if you don't like this culture, you reject it. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> as opposed to you try and figure out the algorithms, so the culture might throw you a breadcrumb or two. Like just that idea of you reject what does not conform to your ethics. And I hope that the people who watch Punk Rock Vegan Movie maybe come away with a reminder of that, that like, you can have principles and sometimes principles can be lonely, sometimes principles can be very isolating as probably every animal rights activist on the planet will tell you. But at least for me, and I can only speak for myself, like my adherence to my values and my principle, that's more important to me than accommodating such a compromised culture. Mm-Hmm.

Lindsay (01:05:13):

<Affirmative>, it's important and what strikes me about it, it is that it's very easy to survive in this world. Never questioning anything. You could go to a grocery store and get whatever, and you don't really have to think about it too hard. You just give them, give someone money and you take the thing home, you know? But I think something that's really beautiful about punk rock is that it says look harder. Like it's a kind of loud, chaotic meditation on the state of our world and how we want it to be, which is really

Moby (01:05:47):

Cool. Oh yeah. I'm it thrills me to hear you say that. And you also hit on an incredibly important point. You know, we live in a world where people feel like so much is out of their control that they don't have agency. But the truth is, every time we spend money, we are supporting a company. Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative>, we're supporting a product, we're supporting a supply chain. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. And I think people sometimes forget about that. And they also forget how incredibly responsive corporations can be if you make it clear to them that you do not approve of what they're doing. I, if enough people tell a corporation they don't like what the corporation's doing, the corporation will change. What's a fascinating thing that's happened over the last few years is every car company in the world is now transitioning to electric cars. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, that was unheard. I mean, inconceivable. And I mean, burger King, McDonald's, they're all trying to go a little more plant-based because they're responding to consumers. So of course people need to vote, they need to protest, they need to express themselves and be activists in any way they can. But the easiest form of activism is just choosing what you spend money on. And if a company's doing something you don't like, let them know. And I promise you they'll pay attention. Yeah,

Lindsay (01:07:03):

That's really, really true. I mean, they're all on a growth model. They all have to grow. And if the old way isn't working, they're very motivated to change. But are we <laugh>, you know, people have to also be motivated to change. And it's hard. I think that looking at your world and trying to keep an open mind on the way that things have always been, it's not easy to do. It's not like we're saying that the punk rock ethos is a, is a, is an easy thing to take on. But I think it's an important, an important ideology.

Moby (01:07:32):

Yeah. I mean it helps if you're like me and you're pretty comfortable being isolated and almost taking solace and comfort in the loneliness that comes with that. I understand other people might not be such isolated misanthrope as me. So it's that question of like, do what you can when you can, but also with whatever resources you have and with the understanding that everybody's different. You know, there's no such thing as one size fits all activism. Okay. So yeah, I feel like we, I've been,

Lindsay (01:08:04):

Well, is it a tangent? It's a tangent.

Moby (01:08:06):

Maybe too much about this issue, but I will say Lindsay.

Lindsay (01:08:11):

Yeah.

Moby (01:08:12):

And bagel.

Lindsay (01:08:13):

mm-hmm. <Affirmative>,

Moby (01:08:13):

Thank you guys for helping me to make this movie because, you know, going out and interviewing people, it was actually kind of the fun easy part. The stuff we've been doing for the last few months of like all the, the business stuff. Oh, speaking of business stuff, we should mention the fact that we're giving the movie away. Like, one of our goals is that no one any, no one anywhere should ever pay for the Punk Rock Vegan Movie. It's free. And if you're paying for it, you shouldn't because we want it to be available for free for every person on the planet.

Lindsay (01:08:47):

Yeah. It's on YouTube. You can download it, you can watch it for free. So if somebody's asking you for money for it don't, unless it's some organization that you really like, in which case Sure. Give them your money.

Moby (01:08:59):

Yeah. <Laugh>. But that, that free ethos, I mean, is so important. We don't want to have any barriers for anyone anywhere being able to watch this movie. And maybe that sounds presumptuous, but the ultimate goal is an activist goal. I mean, I like, one of my only goals in life is to move the needle away from the current system. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, you know, this system that kills a trillion animals every year. And seeing as we have limited resources, we try and use whatever limited resources we have to achieve that. And obviously making the Punk Rock Vegan Movie is we'll see, but hopefully a reasonably effective expression of that.

Lindsay (01:09:44):

So Moby.

Moby (01:09:46):

Yes.

Lindsay (01:09:47):

Something that I think is really cool is that when we were making Punk Rock Vegan Movie, we would occasionally be like, Hey, we need a piece of music that will fit into this transition. And you would go into your house for about 15 minutes and come out with the most incredible track I've ever heard, ever that you just put together because you are a music genius. So one of the things that you also put together for a Punk Rock Vegan Movie is a punk rock version of a song that you had done before called Beautiful. And I was asking you the other day, how did you make a punk rock version? Like you just have a, an innate knowledge of all of the elements that go into it. And I thought that maybe you would walk us through your punk rock version of Beautiful.

Moby (01:10:40):

I would be happy to, but going back many, many, many years. So the original version of Beautiful is one of my least favorite songs of anything I've ever done. Oh

Lindsay (01:10:52):

No. Why?

Moby (01:10:52):

Well, I mean it's perfectly fine, but it's a lighthearted little pop song and it's just, by the way, I don't know if anyone can listen very critically, but in the background you can hear Bagel Whimpering just a little bit because Lindsay is in a different room and I'm in my main studio and Bagel is trying to get in and I really want to go let her in. I

Lindsay (01:11:16):

Think you gotta let her in. She's, she's desperate.

Moby (01:11:19):

Come on Bagel. I know it's not a visual medium, but Bagel is now sitting on my lap. Hi Bagel. Oh, hello. Okay, so getting back to the song Beautiful, the original version, it's not my favorite, which I've said in a few different quasi diplomatic ways, so I'm gonna stop repeating myself.

Lindsay (01:11:37):

Do you think that when you wrote the lyrics you went too vulnerable and it makes you feel uncomfortable because of vulnerability you displayed when writing it?

Moby (01:11:45):

I think it might, I love that question. I think it might be the exact opposite is that it's kind of a song about celebrities. It's, it's just, it's sort of vapid. So it's whatever the opposite of vulnerable is. That's kind of what the song is for me.

Lindsay (01:12:02):

I see.

Moby (01:12:03):

Okay. So this new version we were working on the closing credits for Punk Rock Vegan Movie, which for anyone listening who hasn't seen the movie, the credits have lots of little cutaways to me and bagel work shopping, the title of the movie. And for these little work shopping segments, I wore my best film director outfit. So I'm wearing a black turtleneck and dark glasses looking a little bit like I should be the CFO of a Silicone Valley startup or someone selling like fireworks in Eastern Europe <laugh>. But in any case, there are these adorable little asides of Bagel helping me figure out the title of the movie. And we needed music for this section. And I don't know why I thought this was a chance to redeem this song. Beautiful. And so to your point earlier, I went into my studio while you and Mike were editing this section together and I very quickly threw together this punk rock version of beautiful. And I didn't expect much. And sorry if this is self-serving, it actually came together so much better than I thought it was going to. And I actually ended up really liking this punk rock version way more than the original. Like the original, as I said, is kind of banal. And this one is just, I mean this is ridiculous, but I thought it ended up being really fun. Do you wanna talk about the different elements in the song and sort of break it down a little bit?

Lindsay (01:13:37):

Yeah, I'd love to hear them because if I'm honest, you know, when I am listening to music, because I am not a musician myself, I just hear a bunch of sounds <laugh> and sometimes it just sounds like one sound <laugh> one sound and people saying nice words over it, uhhuh <affirmative>. So I, I guess help me be a less of a music, dumb dumb and to hear the individual parts that you put together. So I can appreciate

Moby (01:14:00):

These. Well, you certainly are not a music, dumb dumb, but nonetheless, let's let's break down all the different elements within the song. Okay.

Lindsay (01:14:09):

Okay. But also, okay, I'd love it if you could, when you're telling me about them, what makes them classically punk rock, you know what I mean? Uhhuh <affirmative>. Like why you chose them for this version.

Moby (01:14:21):

Okay, fun. I can do that. Okay,

Lindsay (01:14:23):

Great.

Moby (01:14:24):

<Laugh>. Okay. So the original beautiful was 95 beats per minute and this punk rock version is twice as fast. So I thought we'd start with the drums. So as you can hear, those are the drums. And what I love to do for these sort of either punk rock or rock songs is combine live elements with programmed elements. Okay, so here's the, the the kick drum. What I mean is this is the, to the kick drum is actually being generated by the computer. But then when I factor in some of the live elements, to me it sounds like it's, it, it's twice as fast as the original and a lot more energetic. And what punk rock song would be complete without the guitars. So here are the guitars, which

Lindsay (01:15:32):

That's not a computer.

Moby (01:15:33):

No, no, that's, that's that's me playing guitar. And then you add in the bass.

Lindsay (01:15:41):

Is that, is that real?

Moby (01:15:42):

That's. Okay. So there's an interesting little story here and I'm gonna turn these guys down just a little bit. At least I think it's an interesting story. Years and years and years and years and years and years ago I did some production and remix for Quincy Jones and Michael Jackson. Well and mainly cuz I just was super curious to see how Quincy Jones worked. I mean's Quincy Jones, like it was, I, so it was on Thriller and

Lindsay (01:16:15):

Wait, what was on Thriller?

Moby (01:16:16):

The work I did

Lindsay (01:16:17):

You worked on the song

Moby (01:16:18):

Thriller? Well the remixes No, it was actually beat it.

Lindsay (01:16:21):

You worked on the remix for Beat It?

Moby (01:16:24):

Yeah.

Lindsay (01:16:24):

Holy...

Moby (01:16:26):

I think I got, I got some history. So laugh> <laugh>. Okay. So the main reason I did it was because I really wanted to see how Quincy Jones worked mm-hmm. <Affirmative>. And one of the things he taught me inadvertently was to combine live bass with synth bass. And so that's what we have here.

Lindsay (01:16:51):

So that's half live, half synth,

Moby (01:16:53):

Half live, half synth, and you end up with like the aggression of both. And normally you wouldn't have live and synth bass on a punk rock song. But I thought once you factor in the guitar live drums, program drums, you end up with this really sort of cool sounding combination of like traditional punk elements with some sort of almost like industrial elements underneath them.

Lindsay (01:17:30):

It does sound industrial.

Moby (01:17:33):

Yep. And then it stops. Oh. So let me, while we're, I'm just gonna move this vocal section up some of the non-vocal parts down.

Lead Vocals (01:17:46):

Love you Baby

Moby (01:17:47):

And there's me.

Lead Vocals (01:17:48):

Love you Now

Moby (01:17:49):

. Ooh,

Lead Vocals (01:17:51):

Look at us, we're Beautiful.

Moby (01:17:53):

So all

Lead Vocals (01:17:54):

The people push and pull but

Moby (01:17:54):

Another thing I learned,

Lead Vocals (01:17:56):

Let's just go out and ride.

Moby (01:17:58):

doing.

Lead Vocals (01:17:59):

Talk about the things we tried.

Moby (01:18:00):

...remixes and productions for other people. Is I learned people the power, sort of what's called stacking vocals

Lindsay (01:18:07):

Yeah.

Lead Vocals (01:18:08):

We've got too much To hide.

Moby (01:18:10):

So, so that's just me, but they're actually 10 of me in there.

Lead Vocals (01:18:17):

Never Get Inside. We've got too much to hide

Lindsay (01:18:20):

. Can I ask a question?

Lead Vocals (01:18:21):

Yeah.

Lindsay (01:18:23):

Is it the same take that you're stacking or is it 10 different takes that you're stacking?

Moby (01:18:27):

It's the same part of the song. So if it's, it's, if it's the verse, it starts off with one lead vocal. And then what I will sometimes do is add doubles, triples, quadruples. Sometimes like on, I made this album or I made two albums called The Void Pacific Choir. And on some of those tracks there are up to 50 or 60 vocals. And the way I learned to do that is I read an interview with the guy who produced Queen and the Cars and he was talking about how he would just stack and stack and stack and you end up with these choirs and it just creates this huge sense of space. And speaking of choirs, so at the very end I decided to add myself as a choir because nothing says punk rock like a choir. So you want to hear me as a choir

Lindsay (01:19:24):

More than anything.

Moby (01:19:24):

kay. So here's me as a completely ridiculous, overly dramatic choir. Isn't that ridiculous? And then we add in that live bass and synth bass, and then we bring in all the other instruments for chaos and drama. That's pretty ridiculous, huh?

Lindsay (01:20:04):

I love it. So what are you saying? We are all so beautiful. What is it?

Moby (01:20:11):

Look at us. We're beautiful.

Lindsay (01:20:17):

<Laugh>, that's really fun.

Moby (01:20:19):

<Laugh>. And so that is the quick weird punk rock version of Beautiful that plays over the end credit of the Punk Rock Vegan Movie. Hopefully. That was interesting. And, and, and I am really glad that Bagel was here to, to sort of like run around and yell in the background.

Lindsay (01:20:42):

It made her really excited. Really, really excited.

Moby (01:20:55):

Okay, so we've gotten a lot of really amazing questions from people that have emailed MobyPod@moby.com. It's,

Moby (01:21:06):

Wait, Lynn, what's that email address again? Well,

Lindsay (01:21:08):

I'll tell you it's MobyPod@moby.com and people are emailing us a bunch of amazing things and I've been emailing back with people and talking to them and it's be en really, really fun. But one of the questions I got from Michelle who also goes by Rebel Wheels, which is cool. Ask this question. Are you prepared to hear a question?

Moby (01:21:30):

I am prepared.

Moby (01:21:31):

Okay, great.

Lindsay (01:21:31):

Well, okay. I mean, I, I don't know what the question is, so I hope I'm prepared. <Laugh>,

Lindsay (01:21:35):

I just mean, are you in a place of relaxed readiness?

Moby (01:21:38):

I mean, insofar as I'm capable of ever being in a place of relaxed readiness, I mean considering I'm like basically anxious from the time I wake up until the time we go to sleep. But given that Yeah, like relatively relative to my normal state of like teeth mashing anxiety, I'm fairly relaxed.

Lindsay (01:21:55):

<Laugh>. Okay. Okay, great. Okay, here's the question. As a creative person, I feel like artists are vessels and which ideas come to us slash through us, but it's much bigger than us as individuals. The two of you are creative people. So I would be curious if you feel creativity is a spiritual slash cosmic thing or how you view the process of inspiration.

Moby (01:22:24):

Wow, what a wonderful question. I thought

Lindsay (01:22:27):

So too.

Moby (01:22:27):

I actually have a thought.

Lindsay (01:22:29):

What's that?

Moby (01:22:29):

At some point? Cause I feel like a question like that deserves a really like, kind of thoughtful long response. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. So maybe at some point, Linds, if you're up for it, maybe we do an entire Moby Pod episode about that question.

Lindsay (01:22:47):

I think that's an amazing idea

Moby (01:22:49):

About creativity cuz the truth is, I, I mean I don't know what your perspective is, but from my perspective, creativity is, I mean, it, it can potentially encapsulate everything. Like it can be a refuge, it can be a form of protest and activism. It can help us connect with other people, it can help us connect with ourselves and the world around us. I mean the world is so baffling, obviously the human world is baffling, but the world beyond that is so baffling and I feel like creativity is sort of like a way of finding refuge within that baffling world, but also channeling some elements of it and sort of representing the human condition within that sort of incredibly baffling context. What do you think?

Lindsay (01:23:34):

Well, yeah, I think that digging into it more and hearing from other people, we had a really interesting conversation with our friend Robert Russell about creativity and finding a way to keep creativity spiritual while living in, you know, late stage capitalism and what that looks like and how do you maintain creativity as a spiritual practice. It's a really, really huge question. And I think that like a little bit our humanity lies in it.

Moby (01:24:01):

Yeah. Without question. Well, no pun intended. So thank you Michelle. And at some point, or hopefully over the next few weeks, we will create an entire episode just simply based on that question.

Lindsay (01:24:14):

Yeah.

Moby (01:24:19):

So thank you so much for listening to this third episode of Moby Pod and I hope you get the chance to watch the Punk Rock Vegan Movie and I hope you don't pay for it because you shouldn't cuz it's a available as we keep saying, it's available for free wherever free movies might be found.

Lindsay (01:24:39):

Exactly. I also wanna say a massive thank you to our guest, Derrick Green for coming and having lunch with us and talking to us for a really long time. It was amazing to have you Derrick, and I hope to have you back again sometime soon. Our editor is Jonathan Nesvadba and we wanna send a big thanks to Human Content for helping get this podcast into your listening device. Thank you so much for listening to Moby Pod.